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Topic: Midi Mapping - Can you? (Read 2564 times) |
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etlnibn
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Midi Mapping - Can you?
« on: Oct 17th, 2001, 7:02am » |
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Hi
I am convinced that I shouldn't have to go out and buy a midi control surface such as the Kenton Freak because I already have an MC505 laden with sliders and knobs etc. All I need to do is do some clever mapping to get my 505 to control the mixers in Cubase, or other soft synths etc.
My question(s) really relates to features which I can not found in the mapping dialogue.
For example, whilst I might want to remap controllers coming in from one midi port, I definitely don't want to remap the same controller coming in from another port. I was surprised by the absence of port as an option in the mapping dialogue - I am missing something here?
Because of the strange midi assignments on the 505 I want to map for example channel 1 to midi channel 2, channel 2, to channel 3 etc. I thought therefore I would create a map which simply adds 1 to the midi channel which is received. I don't use the 505 to transmit on Ch 16 so that shouldn't cause a problem, but probably the programme would have some logic to cope with this anyway. Anyway, anyway, unless I am missing something it doesn't seem possible to do this and it seems I have to map each and every individual channel - am I missing something here too?
Perhaps this last one is just a wish but I thought that there might be some kind of learn feature. So that if you want to remap a controller and the cursor is currently sitting in the control number field - you would wiggle the controller on the synth in question and then click "LEARN" afterwards - this is exactly the set-up in Cubase in the remote control set-up dialogue.
Finally for today, a question about Sys-Exc. There are loads of buttons on the 505 which when pressed generate Sys-Exc to indicate whether they are on or off. The string is almost identical except for one single value. This I naively believed could be used as an ideal source to map to a mute on/off signal for cubase. I would need to send controller information to cubase for this purpose - but I can't seem to find anyway to map this event to something else. Is that just not possible to do?
Is there any more useful information lying around regarding NRPNs - I think these might be even more use in building my ultimate remote control device but I don't really undestand them.
And finally, finally, a wish. The ability to create whole groups of maps and have them assigned to function keys. The idea would be that at any one minute my control surface could be mapped to the mixer in cubase. Then all I would need to do is press the required function key. This would then select a completely different map group which suddenly mean that my control surface is able to edit a softsynth, and then press another function key, load another map group and it is suddenly controlling the transport functions. Hopefully you get the idea. Multiple groups of controller maps in memory at anyone time, with user defineable hot-key selection.
Yes, I would pay reasonable shareware prices for this.
Many thanks in advance for any feedback (should I say constructive feedback).
etlnibn
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tiny_elvis
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Re: Midi Mapping - Can you?
« Reply #1 on: Oct 17th, 2001, 7:43am » |
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hello etlnibn (how do you pronounce that?  ),
I've been talking to Jaimie about some similar needs I have and I don't think MIDI-OX can help us. There is a program called Bome's MIDI Translator that is more specialized for midi translation. Check it out at http://www.bome.com/ , I had to use the Beta version for its better performance with realtime fader data. But the beta version also claims to have MIDI to keystroke translation - which may make you very happy.
Heres the catch: It's not the least bit user friendly. You need to understand midi data and exactly which parts of the midi message you will be tranlating. You probably won't have a problem with that now that i look at your post. You will also need a loopback device like Hubis'...Its link is listed at bome.com ...
And it's postcardware  All you have to do is send him a post card.
Hope this helps,
Chris
http://chriskline.com
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Jamie OConnell
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Re: Midi Mapping - Can you?
« Reply #2 on: Oct 17th, 2001, 11:27am » |
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on Oct 17th, 2001, 7:02am, etlnibn wrote:| ...whilst I might want to remap controllers coming in from one midi port, I definitely don't want to remap the same controller coming in from another port. |
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Currently mappings are global, but we are looking into per-port mappings. Of course you can always run multiple instances of MIDI-OX to achieve per-port mappings, but it would be nicer to be able to do it in a single instance. One of the factors that makes this a bit difficult is that the mapping needs to be done at interrupt time to be efficient. This means that it has to be performed inside the 16 bit thunk (for win 9x versions) and each map needs to be contained in low page-locked memory. It is something which I hope we can add in the near future.
Quote:| Because of the strange midi assignments on the 505 I want to map for example channel 1 to midi channel 2, channel 2, to channel 3 etc. I thought therefore I would create a map which simply adds 1 to the midi channel which is received. ... it seems I have to map each and every individual channel - am I missing something here too? |
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Well, there are only 16 channels possible, and you may have missed the copy/paste functions for the maps (right-click in the mapping dialog)? Once you have copied a mapping, you can quickly paste 15 copies and then tweak them. Once a mapping is setup it can be saved for all-time. You can use previously saved maps as templates, and even append several together in the mapping dialog.
Quote:| Perhaps this last one is just a wish but I thought that there might be some kind of learn feature. |
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I'll keep this in mind as a snazzy feature. Again, since data is passed through at interrupt time, it is not usually available to the upper levels of the application, but maybe we could add a hook to bring it up to a higher level.
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Finally for today, a question about Sys-Exc. There are loads of buttons on the 505 which when pressed generate Sys-Exc to indicate whether they are on or off. The string is almost identical except for one single value... |
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We don't currently have a mechanism to translate SysEx into controllers (only the reverse). It has been requested a few times recently. SysEx was never intended to be a real-time communication protocol, but more and more manufacturers are using it this way. How long are these SysEx strings that the 505 puts out?
Quote:| Is there any more useful information lying around regarding NRPNs - I think these might be even more use in building my ultimate remote control device but I don't really undestand them. |
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Yes, check out the FAQ, we link to a very good description (IMO) by Jeff Glatt: http://www.midiox.com/mfaq.htm
Quote:| And finally, finally, a wish. The ability to create whole groups of maps and have them assigned to function keys... |
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We currently offer Patch Mapping which loads a group of Maps and port mappings when a program change is received. I take your suggestion to mean that you would like this feature enhanced to load maps based on assignable controllers, possibly prefaced by a shift controller? Or were you referring to assignable Computer keyboard hot-keys?
Thanks for the suggestions. 
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| « Last Edit: Oct 17th, 2001, 11:34am by Jamie OConnell » |
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--Jamie
Music is its own reward.
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etlnibn
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Re: Midi Mapping - Can you?
« Reply #3 on: Oct 17th, 2001, 12:57pm » |
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on Oct 17th, 2001, 11:27am, Jamie OConnell wrote:
Currently mappings are global, but we are looking into per-port mappings.
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Okay, I think I understand, but it is good to hear that you are considering it.
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Well, there are only 16 channels possible, and you may have missed the copy/paste functions for the maps.
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Actually I did not miss the cut and paste options - but that probably makes me seem an even more ungrateful user of your wonderful software just for admitting this.
I suupose I am asking because I think this software is so good and I want to provide positive and constructive feedback if at all possible and a promise of cash in the future as a potential paying customer.
I am basing some of my expectations and comments on the logical edit untility / input transformer in Cubase which has functions like add, multiply, divide, minus etc. From a programming perspective I would have thought these kind of things are easier than opening and writing to ports. Leaving aside the interface elements for a moment I would suspect that there are standard functions in C++ for handling HEX manipulation.
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SysEx was never intended to be a real-time communication protocol, but more and more manufacturers are using it this way. How long are these SysEx strings that the 505 puts out?
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They are like the following F0 41 32 00 0E 00 F7. Could you and Bome (creator of the also fabulous Midi-Translator) ever consider merging your two great software empires? Or in the very worst case - just copy the best of each other's ideas.
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We currently offer Patch Mapping which loads a group of Maps and port mappings when a program change is received.
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Okay, I don't think I realised or perhaps understood that you can use the Patch Mapping function to load a group of Maps including port mappings. So no I am a bit confused and will have to go away and look at this. But what I was suggesting was being able to select a group of translation maps from a variety of differnt sources including perhaps the function keys on a normal PC-keyboard - but I suppose logically you might want to use all sorts of triggers to change from one predefined translation group to another, anything from the F2 key on my PC-keyboard to a defined system exclusive message from my 505.
One really cool feature of Miditranslator is the ability to translate midi messages of all kinds to normal computer key commands such as <ENTER> for example.
Okay after all of that noise - I just want to say thank-you for the very fact that you invest your time into creating something so useful and enjoyable as the MIDI-OX.
etlnibn
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Jamie OConnell
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Re: Midi Mapping - Can you?
« Reply #4 on: Oct 17th, 2001, 1:15pm » |
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Your suggestions are appreciated We will strive to make this a better program over time. Mapping, which wasn't even in early version of MIDI-OX, has evolved over time. I am starting to see that users have more and more of a need for it, so we will continue to improve it.
All suggestions are accepted in the spirit they were made, and we won't take critical analysis personally 
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--Jamie
Music is its own reward.
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