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Topic: Very interesting bug! (Read 1948 times) |
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algolcw
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MIDI-OX Rules!
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Very interesting bug!
« on: Aug 17th, 2005, 5:02pm » |
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I’m running MIDI-OX v.7.0.0.365 on XP and on 98SE.
On XP:
All works properly with Casio CTK-811.
At the same time with Korg M1 it is impossible to get a MIDI signal from PC to M1 at all.
That means that there is an output MIDI signal on the out MIDI-port of PC and it is monitored by MIDI-OX but Korg does not receive (or recognize) it.
On 98SE:
All works well with both Casio and Korg.
What the ..... ?
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algolcw
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Re: Very interesting bug!
« Reply #1 on: Aug 19th, 2005, 11:07am » |
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Can anyone help?
Any suggestion?
Any ideas?
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algolcw
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Re: Very interesting bug!
« Reply #2 on: Aug 22nd, 2005, 6:13pm » |
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I just can't believe no one has an idea what this bug means.
Please, someone, at least try to help me, H-E-L-L-O-O-O!!!!
Am I alone in a desert?
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Jamie OConnell
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Re: Very interesting bug!
« Reply #3 on: Aug 22nd, 2005, 7:18pm » |
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You say Casio works correctly in XP, but you get no MIDI signal to M1 in XP. Assuming you are using the same PC MIDI Interface for both, logic would dictate that there is a problem with the M1 or the MIDI interface or driver (or cable), or a problem in your MIDI-OX routing configuration.
Since you say it all works well under Win98SE (you are using the identical same MIDI interface with 98?), then that reduces the problem to either the XP driver (must be different from the 98 driver by Windows rules -- 32 bit driver vs. 16 bit driver), or a problem in your MIDI-OX routing configuration.
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--Jamie
Music is its own reward.
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algolcw
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Re: Very interesting bug!
« Reply #4 on: Aug 23rd, 2005, 5:36am » |
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on Aug 22nd, 2005, 7:18pm, Jamie OConnell wrote:You say Casio works correctly in XP, but you get no MIDI signal to M1 in XP. Assuming you are using the same PC MIDI Interface for both, logic would dictate that there is a problem with the M1 or the MIDI interface or driver (or cable), or a problem in your MIDI-OX routing configuration.
Since you say it all works well under Win98SE (you are using the identical same MIDI interface with 98?), then that reduces the problem to either the XP driver (must be different from the 98 driver by Windows rules -- 32 bit driver vs. 16 bit driver), or a problem in your MIDI-OX routing configuration.
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**********************************************************
Ok, thanks for your response. But let us go step by step.
1) I don’t use simultaneously Casio and Korg with midi-ox, that excludes multi-midi issues.
2) I use the same and the only midi cable that shows that there is no problem with it.
3) I use the same and the only midi routing in both XP and 98SE for both Casio and Korg. Since it works for Casio in XP then it should work in XP for Korg. Correct?
4) Since Korg M1 works correctly in 98SE then his midi interface is OK. Since Casio works correctly in XP then the PC midi interface is OK. Right?
Thus, there are no hardware problems and the midi-ox routings are correct.
And finally, you mentioned possible XP driver problem. But I use only standard Windows XP software. And it works for Casio. Why it doesn’t work for M1 then? And why no one else has the same problem with M1 and midi-ox in XP then? And how to solve this problem?
Thanks,
Max
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Jamie OConnell
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Re: Very interesting bug!
« Reply #5 on: Aug 23rd, 2005, 12:36pm » |
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Lets break it down even further. Take the MIDI Cable and plug it into Casio MIDI Out. Place the other end into M1 MIDI In. Play the Casio -- does it sound the M1?
Now plug that cable from Casio MIDI Out to PC MIDI In. Plug another cable from PC MIDI Out to M1 MIDI In. Run MIDI-OX and choose Options | MIDI Devices... select the MIDI In and MIDI Out device. Open View | Port Routings... and make sure there is a line connecting the 2 MIDI devices. Make sure there are no data maps in effect (Options | Data Mapping...) and make sure there is no filtering being performed (Options | MIDI Filter). Does Playing the Casio still sound the M1? Do you see data being passed through MIDI-OX?
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--Jamie
Music is its own reward.
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algolcw
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Re: Very interesting bug!
« Reply #6 on: Aug 23rd, 2005, 3:47pm » |
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on Aug 23rd, 2005, 12:36pm, Jamie OConnell wrote:Lets break it down even further. Take the MIDI Cable and plug it into Casio MIDI Out. Place the other end into M1 MIDI In. Play the Casio -- does it sound the M1?
Now plug that cable from Casio MIDI Out to PC MIDI In. Plug another cable from PC MIDI Out to M1 MIDI In. Run MIDI-OX and choose Options | MIDI Devices... select the MIDI In and MIDI Out device. Open View | Port Routings... and make sure there is a line connecting the 2 MIDI devices. Make sure there are no data maps in effect (Options | Data Mapping...) and make sure there is no filtering being performed (Options | MIDI Filter). Does Playing the Casio still sound the M1? Do you see data being passed through MIDI-OX?
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*****************************************
Let’s go.
1) Casio midi-out to M1 midi-in. Playing Casio makes M1 sound.
2) M1 midi-out to Casio midi-in. Playing M1 makes Casio sound.
3) In XP:
M1 midi-out to PC midi-in, PC midi-out to Casio midi-in. MIDI-OX is running. Playing M1 makes Casio sound. MIDI-OX shows in- and out- midi activity.
4) In XP:
Casio midi-out to PC midi-in, PC midi-out to M1 midi-in. MIDI-OX is running. No M1 reaction on playing neither Casio nor PC-keyboard (when pc-keyboard option is on). MIDI-OX SHOWS (!) in- and out- midi activity.
With the same above described tricks in Windows 98SE all works correctly.
Magic or what?
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Jamie OConnell
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Re: Very interesting bug!
« Reply #7 on: Aug 23rd, 2005, 3:52pm » |
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Well then the next question is, what brand and model is your PC MIDI Interface? Do you have the latest driver for it? Do you have or can you borrow another PC MIDI interface to compare with? Be aware that drivers written for Windows XP are completely different from drivers written for Windows 98.
Here's an experiment to see what is happening with your MIDI interface: Attach a MIDI Cable from the PC MIDI Out to the PC MIDI In (this creates a loopback). Launch MIDI-OX and choose your hardware MIDI Out. Launch another MIDI-OX and choose your Hardware MIDI In. Open the INPUT monitor in this 2nd MIDI-OX instance. In the 1st instance, Play the computer keyboard and see what data arrives in the 2nd MIDI-OX instance. Is it identical to what is output from the 1st?
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| « Last Edit: Aug 23rd, 2005, 3:56pm by Jamie OConnell » |
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--Jamie
Music is its own reward.
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algolcw
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Re: Very interesting bug!
« Reply #8 on: Aug 23rd, 2005, 4:12pm » |
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That's rather tricky, as I have a standard PC midi-cable with one PC plug and two external midi-device plugs (in and out). So, I need to connect external in and out plugs to each other. Well....
I think I can do that.
Will try to have it done tomorrow.
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algolcw
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Re: Very interesting bug!
« Reply #9 on: Aug 24th, 2005, 11:07am » |
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Here are the results.
In 98SE the midi-loop works. The 2nd MIDI-OX instance (in) receives the 1st MIDI-OX instance signal (out).
In XP with the identical connections it doesn’t work. MIDI output from the 1st instance is not received by the 2nd instance input. No midi-in activity is shown there on the port status monitor of the 2nd instance. In the 1st instance there is midi-out activity.
Is there a way to fix this?
And how can it be that Casio midi-in works correctly in XP then, in spite of all these troubles?
P.S. Here is my system description:
AMD Athlon XP 3200+
512 Mb
nForce-2 ultra-400 motherboard w/onboard C-media AC97 audio device
MPU-401 MIDI device built-in
MS Windows XP Professional v.2002 Service Pack 1
Max
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| « Last Edit: Aug 24th, 2005, 11:32am by algolcw » |
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Jamie OConnell
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Re: Very interesting bug!
« Reply #10 on: Aug 24th, 2005, 12:46pm » |
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Quote:In XP with the identical connections it doesn’t work. MIDI output from the 1st instance is not received by the 2nd instance input. No midi-in activity is shown there on the port status monitor of the 2nd instance. In the 1st instance there is midi-out activity.
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That doesn't sound right: there should be visible MIDI Out activity in the 1st instance. Check View | Port Routings... to ensure that the MIDI-OX Event port is attached to the MPU 401 Output. The MIDI-OX Event port is where the computer keyboard notes come from.
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--Jamie
Music is its own reward.
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algolcw
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Re: Very interesting bug!
« Reply #11 on: Aug 24th, 2005, 1:16pm » |
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on Aug 24th, 2005, 12:46pm, Jamie OConnell wrote:
That doesn't sound right: there should be visible MIDI Out activity in the 1st instance. Check View | Port Routings... to ensure that the MIDI-OX Event port is attached to the MPU 401 Output. The MIDI-OX Event port is where the computer keyboard notes come from.
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Are we hearing each other ?  )))
Where did I say that there is no output activity?
Like I said, there IS midi-out activity in the 1st instance. MIDI-out is available but not received by midi-in of the 2nd instsnce.
You probably didn't read my post carefully .
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Jamie OConnell
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Re: Very interesting bug!
« Reply #12 on: Aug 24th, 2005, 7:31pm » |
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My mistake... It seems there may be a problem with the Windows XP MPU driver and your system and the M1. I'm not sure how the Casio is working if MIDI-OX sees no data?
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| « Last Edit: Aug 24th, 2005, 7:33pm by Jamie OConnell » |
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--Jamie
Music is its own reward.
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algolcw
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Re: Very interesting bug!
« Reply #13 on: Aug 25th, 2005, 1:01pm » |
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on Aug 24th, 2005, 7:31pm, Jamie OConnell wrote:| I'm not sure how the Casio is working if MIDI-OX sees no data? |
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Believe me, the Casio is working on XP with MIDI-OX! After the loopback experiment the simple logics tells that it actually should not work. Magic?
That's why I'm saying "very interesting bug".
I just can't explain this phenomenon to myself.
I am sure that both M1 and Casio are fully functional, as they correctly work with each other and with MIDI-OX in 98SE.
I am also sure that the MPU-401 midi-device on the PC w/Win XP is functional as well, because Casio works correctly in XP with this device.
I think the best I can do in this situation is just upgrading my Windows XP, as my PC midi-device uses standard Win XP built-in drivers.
I'm going to install Win XP Service Pack 2 and then see if it helps.
Do you have any better idea?
Max
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algolcw
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Re: Very interesting bug!
« Reply #14 on: Sep 12th, 2005, 3:43pm » |
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Here I am with the report.
Installation of the latest version of Windows XP did not solve the problem.
Installation of the latest version of the sound card driver (sound card manufacturer's) did not solve the problem.
After all that I removed the sound card from the Win98 computer, where everything had been working properly before. I installed that card to the WinXP computer.
Everything started working in WinXP!
Obviously there is a hardware problem with the midi device of WinXP PC. That MPU-401 device is integrated with the motherboard.
This issue is probably cannot be solved as it seems to be a matter of the MPU-401 internal incompatibility. This device does not recognize its own midi signals.
What I still do not understand is how the Casio can work with that MPU-401 midi device if that device is unable to read itself.
This is a real puzzle.
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Jamie OConnell
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Re: Very interesting bug!
« Reply #15 on: Sep 12th, 2005, 4:04pm » |
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I didn't realize Win98 was on another machine -- I had assumed you were dual booting it. Yeah, all bets are off when you are talking about two different hardwares. It's possible that the motherboard game port does not have a MIDI port or does not have a MIDI Input port. Maybe the casio seems to work because Local On is always enabled, and the Motherboard MIDI Out does work?
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--Jamie
Music is its own reward.
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algolcw
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Re: Very interesting bug!
« Reply #16 on: Sep 12th, 2005, 4:46pm » |
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There are both midi-in and midi-out on the integrated sound card.
Turning local On or OFF of the Casio changes nothing.
That means that the Casio sends and receives midi signals from the card, no matter if Local on or off.
Neither M1 nor MPU itself do not reseive midi from the card's midi-out.
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