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Topic: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1 (Read 9161 times) |
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Travelinni
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Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« on: May 20th, 2019, 2:42am » |
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Hello.
I'm really at the end of my tether. Spent all night searching over the internet , went to korg forums no answer.
I'm using Midi-Ox to dump my patterns and songs to sysex files which is no problem.
The problem is when I'm trying to re-load them back to the Electribe :
-Or it gives me the memory error
-Or i have to put a real slow buffer and still it doesn't work
On the manual Korg says it's channel 1 , I'm not sure how to send sysex on that channel or if midi-ox is sending sysex on all channels but all my midi ins and outs are all correctly linked.
Well and even when the sysex is successful my electribe doesn't perform the writing which is also specified on the manual it says that at the end of the transfer give about 10 seconds or so the electribe can perform the writing which it doesn't!
I'm on windows 10 , I have a midisport 2x2 , I've installed the latest M-Audio drivers.
I've also tried Bome Send-SX and no success whatsoever and I tried all speeds , all settings and nothing.
I'm desperate and frustrated.
Please help.
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| « Last Edit: May 20th, 2019, 2:47am by Travelinni » |
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Breath
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #1 on: May 20th, 2019, 8:32pm » |
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Hi
just a few things to check.
You have turned off the Global Protect . "In Global mode, turn memory protect off." manual page 88
Is the Midi channel set to match the Midi data??
"The EMX-1’s system
exclusive message format is [F0, 42, 3n, 69, ff, ... F7].
F0: exclusive status
42: Korg ID
3n: [n=0~F] global MIDI channel 1~16
69: the EMX-1’s model ID
ff: function ID (type of message)
...
F7: end of exclusive" Manual page 85
Load the Midi sysex dump into the Sysex page of MidiOx (View / Sysex.. then on the new dialog Command Window / Load..)
Check the third number (it will be 30 or 31 or 32 or 33 ... 3D or 3E or 3F).
Ignore the "3" and look at the 0 to F character
It is hexadecimal.
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 A B C D E F
The Midi Channel is 1 to 16 (the character +1)
Use this to set the global Midi channel
OR you could try changing the Global Midi channel until it works.
I am assuming you are following all the instructions in the "Reception" section of the manual page 82
Let me know how you get on.
All the best
Royce
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Travelinni
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #2 on: May 21st, 2019, 6:52am » |
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on May 20th, 2019, 8:32pm, Breath wrote:Hi
just a few things to check.
You have turned off the Global Protect . "In Global mode, turn memory protect off." manual page 88
Is the Midi channel set to match the Midi data??
"The EMX-1’s system
exclusive message format is [F0, 42, 3n, 69, ff, ... F7].
F0: exclusive status
42: Korg ID
3n: [n=0~F] global MIDI channel 1~16
69: the EMX-1’s model ID
ff: function ID (type of message)
...
F7: end of exclusive" Manual page 85
Load the Midi sysex dump into the Sysex page of MidiOx (View / Sysex.. then on the new dialog Command Window / Load..)
Check the third number (it will be 30 or 31 or 32 or 33 ... 3D or 3E or 3F).
Ignore the "3" and look at the 0 to F character
It is hexadecimal.
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 A B C D E F
The Midi Channel is 1 to 16 (the character +1)
Use this to set the global Midi channel
OR you could try changing the Global Midi channel until it works.
I am assuming you are following all the instructions in the "Reception" section of the manual page 82
Let me know how you get on.
All the best
Royce |
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Hi Royce.
Thank you for your kind reply and taking the time to help me in this situation.
It's the Korg EM-1 the black one not the EMX-1 my friend.
Yesterday I took everything up to my older desktop computer with windows 7 installed both midi-ox and bome send sx and still no success with the bulk dumps.
Tried all sorts of midi speed on it but the EM-1 seems to stop responding in lower buffer settings.
With Midi-Ox it gave me error saving SysEx dumps (error writing file).
So I don't think this is due to windows differences so I'm back down on my laptop with windows 10.
In higher settings the transfer completes fine but the EM-1 doesn't perform the Writing function at the end .
The only one that worked was the Global dump because it's a very small dump ,transfer was immediate and the EM-1 lit Write on it's own (Bome SendSX) .
The EM-1 receives it and performs write on it's on which is we want to happen with the bulk Dumps of : Pattern A , Pattern B , Pattern C , Pattern D and Songs but this is really frustrating and sad , I've been after this for 4 days in a row now as I really love to make music in the Electribe and not using Daws or the computer unless there's musical works I want to multi-track.
The EM-1 only allows to perform Dumps of :
Bank Pattern A , Bank Pattern B , C and D , Songs and Global (which I think it's just the global settings defined such as writing protection off , midi filter settings , clock , metronome and the midi channels).
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| « Last Edit: May 21st, 2019, 8:22am by Travelinni » |
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Travelinni
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #3 on: May 21st, 2019, 7:08am » |
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on May 20th, 2019, 8:32pm, Breath wrote:Hi
You have turned off the Global Protect . "In Global mode, turn memory protect off." manual page 88
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yes it's off buddy.
Quote:
Is the Midi channel set to match the Midi data??
"The EMX-1’s system
exclusive message format is [F0, 42, 3n, 69, ff, ... F7].
F0: exclusive status
42: Korg ID
3n: [n=0~F] global MIDI channel 1~16
69: the EMX-1’s model ID
ff: function ID (type of message)
...
F7: end of exclusive" Manual page 85
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I think it should be , in the manual it says it's channel 1 , how to you say on Midi-Ox : Look I want to transfer this on channel 1.
Quote:
Load the Midi sysex dump into the Sysex page of MidiOx (View / Sysex.. then on the new dialog Command Window / Load..)
Check the third number (it will be 30 or 31 or 32 or 33 ... 3D or 3E or 3F).
Ignore the "3" and look at the 0 to F character
It is hexadecimal.
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 A B C D E F
The Midi Channel is 1 to 16 (the character +1)
Use this to set the global Midi channel
OR you could try changing the Global Midi channel until it works.
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Let me have a look at the of what i think at least somewhat ''successful'' midi dumps that i've done have some info that can sort this out once and for all.
Quote:
I am assuming you are following all the instructions in the "Reception" section of the manual page 82
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yes It says that the ''program'' should send a request to the EM-1 etc and so on . I've been back and forth with everything and the manual doesn't help much at all.
I even contacted Korg and they couldn't be bothered themselves!
''Oh just play with the buffer settings. Or it can be your midi interface blablabla'' - they said.
Seriously?
I'm really not happy about Korg really.
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| « Last Edit: May 21st, 2019, 7:10am by Travelinni » |
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Travelinni
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #4 on: May 21st, 2019, 7:19am » |
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Quote:Load the Midi sysex dump into the Sysex page of MidiOx (View / Sysex.. then on the new dialog Command Window / Load..)
Check the third number (it will be 30 or 31 or 32 or 33 ... 3D or 3E or 3F).
Ignore the "3" and look at the 0 to F character
It is hexadecimal.
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 A B C D E F
The Midi Channel is 1 to 16 (the character +1)
Use this to set the global Midi channel
OR you could try changing the Global Midi channel until it works.
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Ok Breath I did as you asked and here's the Dump.
It has the 30 as you said and the F0 at the start.
I don't know about the rest and I apologise for that.
This is a bulk dump of Pattern B (01 to 64)
I checked the ending of the dump and it ends in 00's.
If the dumps are ok , my questions go down to :
-how to I set the global midi channel in midi ox to channel 1
(because that's what the manual says)
- and the right buffer settings for a successful transfer
if everything is correct the transfer should be successful and the EM-1 will receive and finalize the transfer by performing ''Write'' on it's own.
Any help is appreciated thank you.
Some updates and other notes :
- Bome Send FX is freezing in my laptop no matter what midi speed i set it on to.
- The Global Dump ends in F7.
- In my Windows 7 Desktop computer it was the only dump that worked and it was really fast.
Regardig Midi-Ox (On my Windows 10 laptop where I am now) :
- Low Level Output Buffer Size 256/32 - Error
- Low Level Output Buffer Size 512/32 - Error
- Low Level Output Buffer Size 1024/32 - Error
Also tried 256/64 - Error.
Low Level Output Buffer Size 64/32 it's very slow but it seems to work but I don't think the Electribe is performing the Write function after completion.
This is becoming a very strange situation.
1-Windows 10 and the laptop could be the issue.
2-I tried Windows 7 Desktop PC , Global Dump was the only one that worked on standard midi speed (on BomeSendSX) all the other dumps do the same as on my laptop.
3- Windows 7 Desktop PC , using Midi-Ox to save SysEx dumps gives me: ''error writing file''.
At this moment i think that using the desktop would be best unless you have a perfect solution for this to work with win10 laptop or a good solution for win7 desktop pc.
Another note : Both computers have the midiman midisport 2x2 latest drivers installed from M-Audio.
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| « Last Edit: May 21st, 2019, 8:08am by Travelinni » |
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Travelinni
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #5 on: May 21st, 2019, 8:46am » |
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Ok i went back to my desktop windows 7 .
Midi Ox pattern dump successful this time . Managed to save.
Made a global dump and reloaded it back and so far it's the only one that works.
It only memorizes the global settings nothing more.
Now on both midi-ox and bome send sx this is the only function that's working and it's instant.
With the pattern dumps and song dumps i'm not having any success.
output level buffers in midi ox are 128/32. Windows 7 Desktop PC.
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| « Last Edit: May 21st, 2019, 8:50am by Travelinni » |
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Travelinni
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #6 on: May 21st, 2019, 10:45am » |
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Someone told me to add 600ms buffer delay in between , i tried both , none works.
still same settings 128/32. only dump that is working so far is global dump the rest it doesn't.
i also tried to run the Universal Device Inquiry.syx but i'm not getting a response right after as electribe shaman shown on his ER-1 page:
So maybe i'm doing something wrong i'll probably have to do a send/receive in order to get a message back which I'm going to try now.
The weird thing is that the other dumps don't end up with F7!
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| « Last Edit: May 21st, 2019, 10:55am by Travelinni » |
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Travelinni
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #7 on: May 21st, 2019, 11:10am » |
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So yep ends up i was doing it wrong here's my Korg EM-1 Universal Device Inquiry :
I also added an F7 to the dumps that end up in 00 but in the end of the process the EM-1 gives out Error:
Er.1 - Data Could Not Be Written.
My EM-1 has no problems receiving sysex as it shows the loading icon on LED.
The problem is that when sysex transfering is complete the EM-1 ends up stuck in the loading icon and doesn't do anything after that.
If I go back to patterns and such nothing has changed.
The only one that I got working is the global dump which is useless because it only remembers the global settings you're on, it doesn't save anything else.
From the manual :
When the EM-1 receives a data dump, it will take up to
ten seconds to write the data into memory (the Write
key will light). Never turn off the power of the EM-1 during this time. Doing so may damage the data.
And this is what is not happening except for receiving a global data sysex receiving data dump.
I have no problem writing patterns and songs so I don't know why the pattern dumps and song dumps are not registering in.
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| « Last Edit: May 21st, 2019, 1:36pm by Travelinni » |
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Breath
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #8 on: May 21st, 2019, 10:48pm » |
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I typed "EM-1 manual" into Google and got the EMX-1 manual
Sorry I wasn't watching close enough.
Lets step through this ...
For starters with sysex, it always starts with F0 and ends with F7
I got the EM-1 Midi spec from http://www.korg-datastorage.jp/Software/MIDIImp/EM1.pdf
I can't test any of this as I don't have a EM-1 (or an EMX-1 for that matter) so let me know how you get on.
F0 42 3x (confusingly written as 3c in the pdf) 61 is the header - I'll assume midi channel 1
The command for "Current Pattern Dump Request" is 10, so try to send this message to get the current pattern
F0 42 30 61 10 F7
The returned data MUST have a F7 at the end.
According to the pdf the size of the Pattern Dump is 1764 bytes (Table 2)
See ( 8 ) Current Pattern Data Dump on page 4
When looking at the MidiOx input monitor, the incoming sysex is broken up into blocks when there is more than 256 bytes in a single message.
(This is just for display. There won't be extra F7 at the end of each block)
So if the data doesn't have an F7 right at the end of the last block you are missing one or more blocks.
This large sysex size brings us to another problem and it is a major one and that is the Midi interface driver.
If it is the MS one it is limited to a max size of 256 for and single midi message.
BUT you are using a Midisport 2x2 with the M-Audio driver and so this shouldn't be an issue.
Requesting specific Pattern bank dump
F0 42 30 61 1C xx F7
xx = 0 Bank A
xx = 1 Bank B
xx = 2 Bank C
xx = 3 Bank D
Let me know how you get on with these dumps.
There is also a WRITE message mentioned in the Midi spec so perhaps you need to send this message before it writes the Pattern data you have sent.
All the best
Royce
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| « Last Edit: May 21st, 2019, 10:50pm by Breath » |
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Travelinni
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #9 on: May 21st, 2019, 11:34pm » |
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on May 21st, 2019, 10:48pm, Breath wrote:
F0 42 3x (confusingly written as 3c in the pdf) 61 is the header - I'll assume midi channel 1
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yes that's correct.
Regarding midi speeds :
Yes , I'm not running with windows midi drivers , my midiman midisport 2x2 needs to have the M-Audio drivers installed , windows doesn't provide them.
I'm running both buffers @ 128/32.
I'll try and get back to you soon as possible and try inputting those commands that you've wrote. 
Quote:| There is also a WRITE message mentioned in the Midi spec so perhaps you need to send this message before it writes the Pattern data you have sent. |
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Yes. That's supposed to happen after a successful midi sysex upload to the Korg EM-1 as the problem I have is sending midi dumps to it and it doesn't perform the WRITE at the end.
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| « Last Edit: May 21st, 2019, 11:40pm by Travelinni » |
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Travelinni
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #10 on: May 21st, 2019, 11:44pm » |
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Quote:
The command for "Current Pattern Dump Request" is 10, so try to send this message to get the current pattern
F0 42 30 61 10 F7
The returned data MUST have a F7 at the end.
Requesting specific Pattern bank dump
F0 42 30 61 1C xx F7
xx = 0 Bank A
xx = 1 Bank B
xx = 2 Bank C
xx = 3 Bank D
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ok got it. will follow your instructions and i'll come back soon as possible.
So basically you want me to program midi-ox to send the em-1 message : ok i want this dump and then the em-1 will dump it automatically without having to access the ''PRESS SHIFT+KEY15'' in order to dump manually.
Ok so I'll try that and let's hope there's an F7 at the end. If there is then re-uploading back to the EM-1 it'll probably be successful.
Are there no codes for the Songs dump?
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| « Last Edit: May 21st, 2019, 11:50pm by Travelinni » |
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Travelinni
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #11 on: May 22nd, 2019, 5:18am » |
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on May 21st, 2019, 10:48pm, Breath wrote:I typed "EM-1 manual" into Google and got the EMX-1 manual
Sorry I wasn't watching close enough.
Lets step through this ...
For starters with sysex, it always starts with F0 and ends with F7
I got the EM-1 Midi spec from http://www.korg-datastorage.jp/Software/MIDIImp/EM1.pdf
I can't test any of this as I don't have a EM-1 (or an EMX-1 for that matter) so let me know how you get on.
F0 42 3x (confusingly written as 3c in the pdf) 61 is the header - I'll assume midi channel 1
The command for "Current Pattern Dump Request" is 10, so try to send this message to get the current pattern
F0 42 30 61 10 F7
The returned data MUST have a F7 at the end.
According to the pdf the size of the Pattern Dump is 1764 bytes (Table 2)
See ( 8 ) Current Pattern Data Dump on page 4
When looking at the MidiOx input monitor, the incoming sysex is broken up into blocks when there is more than 256 bytes in a single message.
(This is just for display. There won't be extra F7 at the end of each block)
So if the data doesn't have an F7 right at the end of the last block you are missing one or more blocks.
This large sysex size brings us to another problem and it is a major one and that is the Midi interface driver.
If it is the MS one it is limited to a max size of 256 for and single midi message.
BUT you are using a Midisport 2x2 with the M-Audio driver and so this shouldn't be an issue.
Requesting specific Pattern bank dump
F0 42 30 61 1C xx F7
xx = 0 Bank A
xx = 1 Bank B
xx = 2 Bank C
xx = 3 Bank D
Let me know how you get on with these dumps.
There is also a WRITE message mentioned in the Midi spec so perhaps you need to send this message before it writes the Pattern data you have sent.
All the best
Royce
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Done what you asked and still nothing.
Dumps end in 00.
Here's a Pattern A dump if you wanna take a closer look at it.
https://www.sendspace.com/file/2uffuk
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Travelinni
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #12 on: May 22nd, 2019, 8:57am » |
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Quote:When looking at the MidiOx input monitor, the incoming sysex is broken up into blocks when there is more than 256 bytes in a single message.
(This is just for display. There won't be extra F7 at the end of each block) |
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yes that's also correct.
I can see that midi-ox sends each block within a certain byte capacity and i can see that it always ends up with an extra message ending in F7 on the monitor (if you need this info let me know and i'll take a screenshot of it for you to see).
Regarding the SysEx dumps they all end in 00 and this is really puzzling now.
Please note that I've already tried adding F7 manually to the final character of the SysEx dump string and the electribe gives out Error ER.1 - Could not write function and my global write protection setting is set to OFF.
Quote:
Yes that's the right one.
I truly hope that you can find what is going wrong with this and we can work together to reach a solution regarding this problem.
I literally looked everywhere over the internet and there are no solutions whatsoever regarding these old generation electribes as I've seen many other users having the same problem with their ER-1's and so on.
In my case , I have to rely in sysex because these old generation electribes don't have a SD card or Smartmedia slot as the EMX-1/ESX-1 do , so we're all stuck.
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| « Last Edit: May 22nd, 2019, 9:17am by Travelinni » |
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Sonus
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #13 on: May 22nd, 2019, 4:00pm » |
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Request EM-1 current pattern data by sending F0 42 30 61 10 F7
CURRENT PATTERN DATA DUMP = 5 + (1764 x 8/7) + 1 = 2022 bytes
Pattern A Bank.syx seems to miss 129031 - 128000 = 1031 bytes
BANK PATTERN DATA DUMP = 6 + (1764 x 8/7 x 64) + 1 = 129031 bytes
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Travelinni
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #14 on: May 22nd, 2019, 4:07pm » |
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on May 22nd, 2019, 4:00pm, Sonus wrote:
Request EM-1 current pattern data by sending F0 42 30 61 10 F7
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ok will do.
Thanks for joining this topic.
Quote:CURRENT PATTERN DATA DUMP = 5 + (1764 x 8/7) + 1 = 2022 bytes
Pattern A Bank.syx seems to miss 129031 - 128000 = 1031 bytes
BANK PATTERN DATA DUMP = 6 + (1764 x 8/7 x 64) + 1 = 129031 bytes |
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Does this mean that the one I uploaded is missing 1031 bytes?
So in total the dump has to reach a total size of 129031 right?
I'll give it another shot.
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| « Last Edit: May 22nd, 2019, 4:07pm by Travelinni » |
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Travelinni
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #15 on: May 22nd, 2019, 4:42pm » |
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on May 22nd, 2019, 4:00pm, Sonus wrote:
CURRENT PATTERN DATA DUMP = 5 + (1764 x 8/7) + 1 = 2022 bytes
Pattern A Bank.syx seems to miss 129031 - 128000 = 1031 bytes
BANK PATTERN DATA DUMP = 6 + (1764 x 8/7 x 64) + 1 = 129031 bytes |
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Ok here are the results to your information:
So according to your information the EM-1 is not dumping the total number of bytes. Why is that?
Quote:| Request EM-1 current pattern data by sending F0 42 30 61 10 F7 |
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Did that , all the EM-1 does is sending a bunch of info and midi-ox receives a certain number of bytes nothing else.
Tried saving it and loading it up but doesn't do anything.
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| « Last Edit: May 22nd, 2019, 4:44pm by Travelinni » |
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Sonus
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #16 on: May 23rd, 2019, 9:30am » |
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Adding EOX to incomplete files doesn't make any sense, did you already try EM1-SoundDesigner-A.syx?
Initial buffer settings 256x32 usually work well but you also might test with larger buffers 1024x16.
If still not working, try different configurations: another synth, computer or midi interface...
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Travelinni
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #17 on: May 23rd, 2019, 10:43am » |
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on May 23rd, 2019, 9:30am, Sonus wrote:Adding EOX to incomplete files doesn't make any sense, did you already try EM1-SoundDesigner-A.syx?
Initial buffer settings 256x32 usually work well but you also might test with larger buffers 1024x16.
If still not working, try different configurations: another synth, computer or midi interface...
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thanks for the link.
I actually tried to download this the other day and it was giving me no permission but through you it worked.
I'll follow your buffer instructions.
I tried with my laptop windows 10 and it's really slow regarding the buffers so i'm using my desktop with windows 7 instead.
I've had a roland jv-1080 before and had no problems transfering sysex and I was a total noob at it at the time.
Quote:
Adding EOX to incomplete files doesn't make any sense,
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Well yeah that's why the EM-1 was giving out Er.1 Can't Write
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| « Last Edit: May 23rd, 2019, 11:58am by Travelinni » |
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Travelinni
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #18 on: May 23rd, 2019, 11:51am » |
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on May 23rd, 2019, 9:30am, Sonus wrote:Adding EOX to incomplete files doesn't make any sense, did you already try EM1-SoundDesigner-A.syx?
Initial buffer settings 256x32 usually work well but you also might test with larger buffers 1024x16.
If still not working, try different configurations: another synth, computer or midi interface...
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Good news is , that dump worked.
Output buffers 128x32
buffer delays both 60.
Regarding my dumps still nothing . Here are some tests I wrote down:
1024x16/512x16 = 128000b/122880b
2048x16 = 126976b
2048x32 = 126976b
4096x32 = 126976b
If the dump you sent worked that means there's nothing wrong with my midi interface right?
I don't get this , I kept trying all sorts of buffer combos but keeps stopping at the damn 128000
At least we narrowed this problem down to the input buffers , the output buffers are not the problem.
I've no idea why my dumps aren't reaching the 129031bytes .
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| « Last Edit: May 23rd, 2019, 12:42pm by Travelinni » |
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Sonus
Member
MIDI-OX Rules!
Posts: 78
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Re: Help with Korg Electribe EM-1
« Reply #19 on: May 23rd, 2019, 6:06pm » |
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Good news indeed...
MIDI Loop Test: connect your interface output to EM-1 midi-in and the input to EM-1 midi-thru.
In MIDI Devices, select the input and output, uncheck 'automatically attach inputs to outputs'.
In SysEx Configure, set the low level buffers 128x128 with 100ms delay between buffers.
Now load EM1-SoundDesigner-A.syx in command window and send/receive sysex...
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