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        MIDI-OX >> Mapping Questions >> What port is used for Prog.Change to switch ports
        
(Message started by: rkwb on Jun 4th, 2003, 8:32pm)
Title: What port is used for Prog.Change to switch ports
Post by rkwb on Jun 4th, 2003, 8:32pm
Hi there !

I have setup a test environment to check out the behaviour of changing port mappings via program change.

I see that I can select on which MIDI channel I want MIDI-OX to react and switch the port mappings. However, is there also a possibility to select the port ?

What I want to achieve is that the changing of the mapping is only accepted via a specific Port in order to avoid confusion for other instruments. How do I do that ?

Thanks and best regards
RKW
Title: Re: What port is used for Prog.Change to switch po
Post by Jamie OConnell on Jun 4th, 2003, 9:06pm
You cannot directly choose which port the Program change will go to: it goes to all attached output ports.  Since you can control which channels are sent to which ports, that is one way that you can restrict program changes to specific channels.  In the next MIDI-OX version (beta is available now), you have the option to prevent the Program change from being issued at all, and if it is issued it is only done after the new map has been loaded.
Title: Re: What port is used for Prog.Change to switch po
Post by rkwb on Jun 5th, 2003, 3:41am
Hi Jamie !

Thanks for the answer so far ! However, I somehow don't get it.
You wrote:
You cannot directly choose which port the Program change will go to: it goes to all attached output ports.  Since you can control which channels are sent to which ports, that is one way that you can restrict program changes to specific channels.

Let's assume I have two keyboards and want to route them to 6 different VST instruments. So two physical MIDI ports would be mapped to MIDI Yoke NT 1-6. Every useful combination would be stored as port map. Then I would have one track in Cubase reserved for the program change that should control MIDI-OX. I would assign MIDI Yoke NT 8 as the output port for this. So I  would map MIDI Yoke NT 8 to MIDI Yoke 7 in order to have an open port.

Will a program change in the Cubase track using MIDI Yoke NT 8 trigger the loading of a new port map in MIDI-OX ?
Will other program changes on other ports (let's say on the physical input ports) do the same ?

Thanks and best regards
RKW
Title: Re: What port is used for Prog.Change to switch po
Post by Jamie OConnell on Jun 5th, 2003, 11:03pm

Quote:
Will a program change in the Cubase track using MIDI Yoke NT 8 trigger the loading of a new port map in MIDI-OX ?


Yes.  


Quote:
Will other program changes on other ports (let's say on the physical input ports) do the same ?


Yes.

Please view the picture below: all connections are routed through the single, global Patch Mapping Facility.

On the next version of MIDI-OX (see the Beta), you will be able to prevent the triggering Program changes from being issued on any other ports by clearing a global option: [ ] Send Patch through new map.  

You could also prevent Patch changes on specific other ports from being issued, if you assign a Data Map to the input-ouput connection.  For instance, looking at the picture, you could prevent a program change from being sent from the DR770 to MIDI Yoke 2 by creating a map such as:

 
DATA MAP
Ch Message V1Min V1Max V2Min V2Max C|Ch Message V1Min V1Max V2Min V2Max Ac
* ProgChg     *     *     *     *  | * Discard     *     *     *     *  

Saving it as DiscardProgChg.oxm and assigning it to the DR770 to MIDI Yoke 2 connection.

http://www.midiox.com/forumpix/portmap1.gif
Title: Re: What port is used for Prog.Change to switch po
Post by rkwb on Jun 8th, 2003, 6:41am
Hi Jamie !

Thanks for your detailed answer. I tried it and it works like a charm. This opens great new capabilities for live usage. I guess a lot of people don't know about the power of MIDI-OX and MIDI-Yoke, unfortunately.

Even though, I can live with the limitation that all program changes go to all ports by strictly using different channels, I would suggest to extent the architecture to do the mappings and filterings on a port/channel combination. Planned ? Considered ? Rejected already ?

Also, is there a reason for the 8 ports of MIDI-Yoke, as I could imagine to make use of a few more in a larger live setup ?

Thanks and best regards
Richard

P.S.: My donation will come, you deserve it !!!!
Title: Re: What port is used for Prog.Change to switch po
Post by Jamie OConnell on Jun 8th, 2003, 12:39pm

Quote:
Even though, I can live with the limitation that all program changes go to all ports by strictly using different channels, I would suggest to extent the architecture to do the mappings and filterings on a port/channel combination. Planned ? Considered ? Rejected already ?


Yes. It is planned that the next version will route the triggering program change through the individual connection's Port Maps after swapping in a new global data map and/or port mapping.  So, you will be able to control whether a Program change is issued on any particular port.


Quote:
Also, is there a reason for the 8 ports of MIDI-Yoke, as I could imagine to make use of a few more in a larger live setup ?


Under NT OS's (Win 2000/XP), the number of ports is not dynamically configurable.  Eight was chosen as the number that satisfied most peoples requirements, without getting in the way.
Title: Re: What port is used for Prog.Change to switch po
Post by rkwb on Jun 8th, 2003, 4:03pm
Hi Jamie !

Your answer raises another question...

does MIDIOX also do a MIDI Merge ? I have the problem (well real problems are somewhat different...) that I have one stream of MIDI Data coming through my Guitar to MIDI Interface (AXON) and I want to add the breath controller of my master keyboard (Yamaha KX76, until I can get a Anatek Wind Machine, someone offering one ??? ;-) ). Will that work ?

And, just to make sure, I think also the data mapping should be considered to add the port into the formula, allowing to manipulate just data from a specific port !

And last not least, any chance to have an installation parameter to set the maximum of MIDI Yoke ports ? If you think of the vast of VSTi's plus the fact that some of them are even multichannel (like Halion), then some more ports would fit nicely.

But thanks anyway so far, your tools help  A LOT already.

best regards
RKW

P.S.: FYI, I had a crash of MIDI-OX 6.7 beta, if I tried to map a physical port where the hardware was currently not attached. Yeah, I know it's silly to do that, but may be the error handling can be improved...  ;-)
Title: Re: What port is used for Prog.Change to switch po
Post by Jamie OConnell on Jun 8th, 2003, 7:15pm

Quote:
does MIDIOX also do a MIDI Merge ? I have the problem (well real problems are somewhat different...) that I have one stream of MIDI Data coming through my Guitar to MIDI Interface (AXON) and I want to add the breath controller of my master keyboard (Yamaha KX76, until I can get a Anatek Wind Machine, someone offering one   ). Will that work ?


Yes.  That should work just fine.  MIDI-OX merges inputs, and so does each MIDI Yoke port when it is attached to more than one application.


Quote:
And, just to make sure, I think also the data mapping should be considered to add the port into the formula, allowing to manipulate just data from a specific port !  


Yes.  That is the whole point of individual data maps.  While there is one global data map that is displayed in the dialog, maps can be save as .oxm files and can be assigned to each Input-Output connection (right-click on a connection in the Routing view of the Beta).


Quote:
And last not least, any chance to have an installation parameter to set the maximum of MIDI Yoke ports ? If you think of the vast of VSTi's plus the fact that some of them are even multichannel (like Halion), then some more ports would fit nicely.


Sorry, Windows does not allow this for Windows 2000 or XP.  Have you tried connecting a single MIDI Yoke to multiple applications?  Each MIDI Yoke port can attach to up to 4 applications on either end (Input or Output).


Quote:
P.S.: FYI, I had a crash of MIDI-OX 6.7 beta, if I tried to map a physical port where the hardware was currently not attached. Yeah, I know it's silly to do that, but may be the error handling can be improved...  


Could you elaborate?  Are you saying that the driver opens even when the hardware is not attached?  What device is this?
Title: Re: What port is used for Prog.Change to switch po
Post by rkwb on Jun 9th, 2003, 8:36am
Hi Jamie !

Right clicking on the MIDI port routing gives some insigth, so thanks for that already.

Quote RKW:And last not least, any chance to have an installation parameter to set the maximum of MIDI Yoke ports ? If you think of the vast of VSTi's plus the fact that some of them are even multichannel (like Halion), then some more ports would fit nicely.  


Answer Jamie: Sorry, Windows does not allow this for Windows 2000 or XP.  Have you tried connecting a single MIDI Yoke to multiple applications?  Each MIDI Yoke port can attach to up to 4 applications on either end (Input or Output).

Well, I haven't tried yet, but you are propably right. The wish came up in order to avoid the usage of the Input Filter of Cubase. Having more ports would give a more straightforward overview, but...it's nothing that could not be achieved otherwise.

I'll continue the bug report in the beta-forum.

Thanks and best regards
RKW


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