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        MIDI-OX >> Mapping Questions >> Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
        
(Message started by: MattBlackLamb on May 4^th, 2010, 11:15am)

Title: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by MattBlackLamb on May 4^th, 2010, 11:15am

Hi all I have an Xbox 360 pad which I would like to map to ableton. I am using Rejoice to map the controls on the pad into midi messages which do come into ableton but cannot be mapped, (I have a similar problem with the knob / sliders ect on my midi keyboard, not sure if it's related).

I have tried using Midi translate to turn some of the note messages into Program change messages but according to the output log this is not working.

My machine is a 2.5Ghz quad core with 4GB of RAM running Windows 7 64 bit.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by Peter L Jones on May 4^th, 2010, 2:23pm

How are you using MIDI OX in your set up?

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by MattBlackLamb on May 4^th, 2010, 2:32pm

I want to use it to change the midi messages that Rejoice generates in to (ideally) CC messages. I couln't see CC as an option in the translate menu hence the ideally.

Thanks for the reply :)

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by Peter L Jones on May 4^th, 2010, 4:49pm

You need to route MIDI message from your MIDI In, through MIDI OX then out of MIDI OX, then in to Live. The real question is, how are you going to connect MIDI OX to Live? Do you have a spare MIDI Out and MIDI In port you can use?

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by MattBlackLamb on May 4^th, 2010, 7:32pm

Rejoice goes into Midi Yoke output 1 which goes into Midi Ox. Midi Ox then outputs to Midi Yoke output 2 which is the one that is activated in Ableton.

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by Peter L Jones on May 5^th, 2010, 3:09am

OK, that should work then.

Options->MIDI Devices...
1) Select Output Yoke Out 2 first
2) Select Input Yoke In 1 second
(this way, they should automatically attach properly)
3) Name and save that, then close the window

Continuous controllers are event type "Ctrl" in the Data Mapping window.

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by MattBlackLamb on May 5^th, 2010, 1:38pm

I have done the in / out settings you said but the output is still saying the same thing as the input even though the midi translate is changing them to CTRL messages.

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by Peter L Jones on May 5^th, 2010, 3:02pm

Oh, there's a checkbox on the Data Mapping form. Just before you hit "OK", you need to make sure it's checked. It's labelled "Turn map on (after OK)". I usually forget that... (hence having forgotten to mention it ::)).

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by MattBlackLamb on May 5^th, 2010, 8:21pm

That box is checked. Still no difference.

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by Peter L Jones on May 6^th, 2010, 3:06am

Cab you post a screen print of the Data Mapping screen, please.

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by MattBlackLamb on May 6^th, 2010, 5:12am

This is a screen shot of the main window:
http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m318/MattBlackLamb/MidiMapping1.png

A screen shot of the first setting in the window:
http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m318/MattBlackLamb/MidiMapping2.png

And a screenshot of the second setting:
http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m318/MattBlackLamb/MidiMapping3.png

I only have those two parameters set up at the moment to see if I was doing things right. The messages coming from channel 1 should all be note on / off messages & I want to change them to CC messages if possible.

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by Peter L Jones on May 6^th, 2010, 1:34pm

That looks very strange.

You want to match "any event" on Channel 1, where the first data byte is exactly "1" or "2" (for a note, 60 is Middle C, so that's about 5 octaves below) and the second data byte is anything (so any velocity).

For Note 1, you want to output CC1 with the value set to the note velocity. For Note 2, you want to output CC2 with the value set to the note velocity.

Is that what you wanted?

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by MattBlackLamb on May 7^th, 2010, 7:36am

I want to ouput CC messages yes, have I got the settings correct for output? I can see where I have gone wrong with the Input, the note messages that are being recived are C# (not sure which one ay present) I will find out what numbers I need to set the inputs to.

The pad has a total of 10 buttons on one midi channel (channel 1), 2 thumbsitcks and two triggers on midi channel 2 and a D-Pad on midi channel 3. At the moment only the left thumbstick is being recognised as a continuous controller, the other one is sending note messages.

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by MattBlackLamb on May 7^th, 2010, 9:10am

Sorry for the double post.

The midi note range on channel 1 is C# -1 to Bb -1. I have looked up the midi not numbers (http://tonalsoft.com/pub/news/pitch-bend.aspx) and applied the corresponding number to the settings. It still has not worked though.

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by Peter L Jones on May 7^th, 2010, 3:32pm

Better to look at the input monitor to see the numbers MIDI OX thinks are coming in. You can access the input monitor under the View menu. If that doesn't get you there, post a screen shot of what's coming in, too.

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by MattBlackLamb on May 7^th, 2010, 4:33pm

This is what I see in the in / out windows. I only pressed a few buttons (the note on / off messages) the analogue controllers seem to be very sensitive, much more so than they are in games.

I have changed the translator settings to change any messages on Midi channel 2 as this seems to be where things are coming in, however it hasn't made any difference.

http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m318/MattBlackLamb/MidiInOut.gif

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by Peter L Jones on May 8^th, 2010, 4:11am

Strange...

OK, let's try something else. Delete your existing mapping lines and add one that says

Match:
Any Channel, Any Event, -1, -1, -1, -1 (i.e. all the default values)

Output:
Channel 16, KeyAft, 127, 127, -1, -1

Could you also do "View->Port routings" and post that screen.

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by MattBlackLamb on May 8^th, 2010, 7:42am

The translate settings you suggested work.

If you want the image for the midi routings it can be found at:
http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m318/MattBlackLamb/MidiPorts.gif

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by Peter L Jones on May 8^th, 2010, 7:52am

on 05/08/10 at 07:42:33, MattBlackLamb wrote:

The translate settings you suggested work.

Can't think why yours don't, then! Hmm. ???

OK, in the same mapping add a second rule:
Match: Channel 2, Any, -1 ... -1
Output: Match Input, Ctrl, -1 ... -1

Can you post the input/output monitor views for this, please.

(Oh and can you delete that picture I asked for in the previous post, please... it's a bit big and didn't really help me! :))

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by MattBlackLamb on May 8^th, 2010, 10:45am

That works:
http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m318/MattBlackLamb/MidiInOut2.gif

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by Peter L Jones on May 8^th, 2010, 12:06pm

Hmm... OK, delete everything and add these:

Match: Channel 2, Any, 1, 1, -1, -1; Output: As input, Ctrl, -1 ... -1
Match: Channel 2, Any, 2, 2, -1, -1; Output: As input, Ctrl, -1 ... -1

Something vaguely like this (I used different Note values so set the output Ctrl number and wasn't fussed about Channel...):
http://dino.drealm.info/peter/media/ExMapping.png
OK, so it's probably not that helpful ;).

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by MattBlackLamb on May 9^th, 2010, 7:57am

The text settings you posted have worked.

Out of interest, is it possible to make the controller less sensitive? Every time I press a button I get midi info sent from one of the thumbsticks after I release the button. Is there something I can do in Midi Ox to help rectify the problem?

I have tried calibrating the controller using windows but to no avail so far.

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by Peter L Jones on May 9^th, 2010, 8:16am

I'm not sure what you mean exactly by "less sensitive".

If you want to discard events that match a particular pattern, you can do that (set Output Event Type to Discard).

For example, to discard any controller message with a value of 16 or under:
Match: Any, Ctrl, -1, -1, 0, 16; Output: Match, Discard

And to map the remaining message to cover the full range:
Match: Any, Ctrl, -1, -1, 17, 127; Output: Match, Match, -1, -1, 0, 127

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by MattBlackLamb on May 9^th, 2010, 3:40pm

The only thing I can think of is that the thumbsticks move very slightly when I press a button on the controller, this is turned into midi information which (in this case) is undesireable as all I want is the button press.

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by Peter L Jones on May 9^th, 2010, 4:43pm

Your warranty will be void if you do this but... Try opening the controller up and seeing if there's any tensioning mechanism on the joystick. It may need tightening to stop the unwanted movement. Or post on an XBox forum to see if someone who knows the hardware has any suggestions... that might be safer! ;D

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by MattBlackLamb on May 9^th, 2010, 6:08pm

Ok, I'll have a look on the net for and answer.

Thanks very much for your help, it's been really useful.

Title: Re: Mapping and Xbox 360 pad to Ableton
Post by yingxuy on Dec 5^th, 2011, 12:46am

Try to open the controller to see if there is any tension on the lever mechanism. It may need to be tightened to stop unnecessary movement.